Thoughts as they occur...

Thoughts from a chaotic mind

Sunday, March 21, 2004

What Do You Think?

The following exchange took place between two people who shall remain unidentified. The first message was sent in response to and e-mail being sent around the Internet. The “offending” message and resulting dialog follow thereafter.


You send this stuff around like the bumper sticker of the day. If you and your like-minded friends cannot forward project where this is leading, I pity you. Self-righteousness has nothing to do with it. There are rules of nature and then the Laws of the Tanakh. Of course, since you are a liberal Jew, the Tanakh is nothing more than a story book that can be interpreted as a "living breathing document". The liberal left suffers from moral incrementalism always trying to irritate people for their own selfish ends. Many people are willing to live and let live in society, but why does the demographic feel so oppressed and continue to push people where they refuse to go. Who is really intolerant in this picture? Where is the line drawn? What standards do we pass on to our children?

We have people being blown up in Spain and the gay marriage issue gets top placement in the Chronicle. Don't you ever think that there is something wrong with people's priorities?

It is very clear to me that when people focus more on what is between their legs, than what is between their ears, they are regressing to a lower being running on instinct. When I was an idealistic kid, I thought it was supposed to go the other way. I dreamed of humans reaching some higher level of consciousness, but it was soon shattered when the guru of the month was caught fornicating with everything in sight.

Not a pretty situation



The “offending” document

Advice for the self-righteous
For the self-righteous: vow to quit meddling
By Beth Quinn

Times Herald-Record in North Carolina

I was going to leave the gay marriage issue alone just to save myself some grief. But then I thought, what fun would that be? Somebody's got to irritate the self-righteous folks who tell the rest of us how to live, and it might as well be me. You know who you are, so get your writing implements ready because you'll want to damn me to hell by the time we're done here.

For me, there is one central question in the whole gay marriage controversy: What do you care? What difference does it make in your own life if two gays or lesbians get married? It simply mystifies me that you feel threatened by this. What possible harm could it do in your personal, little life whether the two guys living at the end of your block say "I do"?

I keep hearing the same pat answer from your prophets of doom that allowing homosexuals to marry will "destroy the institution of marriage." Well I gotta' tell you, a lot of gays and lesbians have been getting married in San Francisco lately, and so far my own institution of marriage is doing just fine. I checked. When I heard they were lining up for licenses, I asked my husband if he felt our marriage was going downhill on account of it. He just ignored the question and wanted to know what kind of perennials I thought we should put in this spring. I took that as a good sign. Perennials are an investment in the future, so I figure he's sticking around despite what those homosexuals are doing.

So, self-righteous folks, I guess I'm wondering what's wrong with your own marriages that you feel so threatened by another couple's happiness. Are you unable to sustain a good sexual relationship knowing that two gay guys are sleeping together in wedded bliss? Are you unable to have an intimate conversation with your spouse because you're distracted by the notion of two women going off on a honeymoon?

Because if your marriage is that unstable, you should stop worrying about what others are doing and tend to your own problems before your divorce contributes to the decline of the institution of marriage. I've given this a lot of thought, and I've completely failed to come up with ways that gay marriage will have an impact on your life. It won't raise your taxes.

It won't cause the kid who shovels your driveway to quit. It won't make your laundry dingy. It won't alter the weather. It won't cause your dog to start passing gas. It won't affect your relationship with God. It won't cause you to develop a tumor on your head.

Those of you who would talk about grand concepts like society and institutions and pillars and guideposts and moral fibers and whatnot, I say this is just your excuse for meddling. And history has shown us that nothing good ever comes of meddling in other people's affairs. Every time Christians showed up to mess with heathens, for example, we just ended up with a lot of unhappy heathens with syphilis and smallpox. Those of you who would point out that the dictionary definition of the word "marriage" involves a man and a woman, let me point out that the dictionary is a living, breathing document that changes as word usage changes. If you doubt it, look up the word "dot" in a current edition.

We the people get to decide what's in the dictionary. The dictionary doesn't get to dictate our societal conventions. Your hair isn't going to catch on fire if the definition of marriage is eventually changed to read, "two consenting adults" instead of "man and woman."

As for the Bible, which is always the last refuge for those of you who want to impose your will on us savages, we're not all reading out of the same book. More fundamentally, the Bible is not a legal document. If it were, those who fail to love one another would be rounded up and thrown in jail.

The prison budget would go through the roof what with all the new cells we'd be needing for the neighbor haters.

I have only this advice to offer those of you who oppose gay marriage: Don't marry a homosexual. If you're a man and you don't want to marry another man, for crying out loud, stick to your guns! That would be a terrible idea. You'd be miserable! Same for women. Marry someone of the opposite sex if that's your personal preference.

After all, no one's got the right to meddle in your private affairs.


John, if you had read this with an open mind you would see that what you've written is inaccurate. Whether gay people marry has NOTHING to do with you. It's not being forced on you. It's happening between others. I really feel sorry that you can't see beyond your own ideology to the happiness of people who want to commit to one another. I would remind you that the same sorts of outrage greeted interracial marriages when we were small children. They were considered against the laws of God and nature and the were definitely against the laws of this land.

As I can't relate to fundamentalist Muslims' ideology or that of fundamentalist Christians, I can't relate to the beliefs of fundamentalist Jews. They have no bearing on me unless someone attempts to force them on me. As for gay marriage taking precedence over the bombing in Spain, that's absurd. The bombing has been on the front page, above the fold since it happened. You create a straw man and then you bat at it.



Did you ever hear the Biblical admonition about throwing pearls before swine? I hate to do this, because I really do enjoy your jokes that you send out, but could you kindly remove me from all mailings?

Thanks and take care,




I've enjoyed most of our conversations and am sorry you've decided to take yourself off the list.

Be well,




At the end of the day, two individuals must have a shared sense of right and wrong, good versus evil, and then get into the details of life. The new AMERICAN liberal mindset has gone so far afield and is so poisoned by its own political and social goals that a high level of intolerance, racism, etc. is strangling it. There is no discussion of the issues that matter to the little people, only the issues that matter to the "intellectual elite" with personal agendas.

A sage told me that one must cut and run or get crushed by the inevitable collapse and that is what I am doing.



What do you think??

posted by Gary  # 3/21/2004 11:11:00 PM
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